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Zombie Book Club
Welcome to Zombie Book Club! We're a Podcast that's also a book club! We talk about Zombie / Apocalyptic horror novels, TV and movies.
Zombie Book Club
Wizards of the Apocalypse with Special Guest Catherine Larkin | Zombie Book Club Ep 94
In this episode of Zombie Book Club, we welcome Catherine Larkin—also known as Author X Zombie—author and illustrator of the Wizards of the Apocalypse series. Catherine shares her journey from crafting stories in high school to building the richly imagined world of Skeletonia, where intelligent zombies don armor, cast spells, and follow the commands of the formidable demon Malice.
We delve into Catherine's creative process, exploring how her dual talents in writing and illustration bring depth to her characters and settings. She discusses the themes of authenticity, friendship, and self-discovery that permeate her work, offering insights into how personal experiences have shaped her storytelling. Join us as we explore a unique fusion of fantasy and horror that challenges genre boundaries and captivates readers of all ages.
Guest Contact Information and Relevant Links:
- Website: www.x-zombie.com
- Instagram: @authorxzombie
- Books on Amazon: Wizards of the Apocalypse: The Forgotten Prophecy
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Welcome to the Zombie Book Club, the only book club where the book has wizards and zombies who like to read. Are they going to start some kind of ne, the only book club where the book has wizards and zombies who like to read? Are they going to start some kind of nefarious book club of some sort? And what would they even call this zombie book club? Necrotomes Guild? I'm Dan, and when I'm not practicing my own wizard magic, I'm writing a book about an apocalypse that's not nearly as whimsical as the one we're discussing today.
Speaker 2:And I'm Leah, and today we are chatting with ex-zombie also known as Catherine Larkin. Catherine is the author and illustrator of the Wizards of the Apocalypse series. Growing up in Washington State, she spent her free time voraciously reading, drawing and playing piano, and she began writing the first book in this series during her junior year of high school how badass is that? And has three books in the series already and is now working on her fourth. Welcome to the show, catherine. We are so excited to have you.
Speaker 3:It's so good to be here. I'm so excited. I know it's been a long time coming.
Speaker 2:I feel like I found you maybe a year ago and I've been following you ever since and I just love looking at your art, especially thank you.
Speaker 3:my, I really like to draw. It's so fun. That's another thing I was doing when I was young. I would always draw. I was very inspired by, like anime, manga, stuff like that, like the really expressive faces and the big eyes. I love it.
Speaker 2:That definitely shines through in your work.
Speaker 1:Thanks. So we we have some. We have some very important questions to ask you, as in all interviews. Yes, we will be judging you based on You'll be scored on a rubric. Okay, that's how a school works, right.
Speaker 2:The rubric changes every time and we'll be making it up.
Speaker 1:Yes, don't worry about it, we'll be. We'll be. We'll be scoring on a a curve. Okay, that's scoring on a curve.
Speaker 2:Okay, you'll either bring up the average or bring down the average and you won't know because we're not going to tell you.
Speaker 1:Brains will not be reported to anyone Kept a secret until graduation, alright. First question you have a choice here, a big choice to make. You get to choose whether or not you um live in a zombie apocalypse or you commute to a 40-hour work week at a job oh my gosh, I'd rather take the job, because I mean, I do commissions, so I actually do do drawings for people.
Speaker 3:I mean it's not 40 hours, but but it's what I do outside of writing, so I'd rather do that. I don't want to live in an apocalypse. No, thank you.
Speaker 2:I think it's amazing that you can make your focus your art and your writing.
Speaker 3:Thank you. Yeah, I love drawing for people and I'm actually going to be drawing for a friend's book soon, so I'm excited, oh that's great.
Speaker 2:Is it a totally different kind of? I'm sorry, I know we're supposed to be in rapid fire. I'm going to hold my questions.
Speaker 1:No, I think you should ask your questions, leah. Okay, get those questions out.
Speaker 2:I'm just curious if it's a uh, what the if you're them to have at least one zombie drawn by you?
Speaker 3:no, they can have anything, as long as it's not I don't. Now I do have where I can't. I don't. I won't draw like spicy things. You know I don't like I'm because my channel is more kid oriented. I don't want to be drawing, nothing wrong with it, it's just I don't want to put that on my page yeah but other than that I'm free range. You can, I'll draw whatever, as long as it's not like harmful or offensive or that's good to know.
Speaker 2:I may be requesting zombies I got bad news.
Speaker 1:You didn't get that 40 hour work week like we, like we discussed. Instead, you are in a zombie apocalypse. I'm sorry, that's just how it happens, oh man, otherwise all these questions would be totally irrelevant sense, but anyways, you're in the zombie apocalypse. What is your weapon of choice?
Speaker 3:either an axe or a. I used to take archery lessons.
Speaker 1:That's fun. I love archery. You can't see it, but I've got a bow right behind me. Did you do axe throwing too?
Speaker 3:No, I want to though.
Speaker 2:What kind of bow do you have?
Speaker 3:I don't know the name of it, but it's just not a hunting bow, it's literally just like a sport bow where we would do it. It was like a. It's not a hunting bow, it's literally just like a sport bow where we would do it. And it was like a gym class where we would shoot at targets and things yeah, that's fun I don't know the name though just like a simple, like recurve I think so, yeah, basically, yeah, I think those are the best anyways, though, like the fact that you can shoot any kind of boat ahead of the curve yeah, uh, that's.
Speaker 1:I mean, that's something I would like to see a lot more in zombie apocalypse shows and movies. It's like for for a while, daryl dixon made the crossbow really, really popular, exactly. Just see that showing up in movies and tv shows all over the place and it's like, hey, um, a bow is like a stick with a string. Why aren't people discovering?
Speaker 2:this technology. It's been around for thousands of years, um all right exactly uh, it's, it's the zombie apocalypse.
Speaker 1:I'm so sorry. Uh, you only get to eat one unlimited shelf, stable food item for the rest of your life, but you do get to choose. Like it's a genie situation, I guess. Like you can wish for it maybe, um, and then you find like a warehouse, uh, which would you choose? What's your, what's your food item?
Speaker 3:oh my gosh, probably just like canned food, I guess soup or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, is there a particular flavor of soup that you would want that you could eat for the rest of your life?
Speaker 3:probably like I like potato soup, I also like um vegetable soup yeah I also really like, um, you know, meat soup and broth and things, so yeah, we would be a good pair.
Speaker 2:I would eat all the vegetable soup. Yeah, dan, we eat the potato soup.
Speaker 1:You might get left with the broth I like vegetable soup too, though that's true.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean you can do a lot with that, you know if, if you're, if you're going out foraging to supplement your unlimited supply of vegetable soup, like you can do a lot with that. You know, if, if you're, if you're going out foraging to supplement your unlimited supply of vegetable soup, like you can throw some stuff in there I think you're also our first canned soup person, which, like, is a little surprising, because we've asked this question a lot and you're the first one people say oh, peanut butter
Speaker 2:seems to be the refrain lately like I don't know, we've had like four peanut butters in a row, or like rice or beans, yeah, um yeah, mac. And cheese, like the like they're just like. We'll add water, since we won't have anything else definitely one person wanted beans yeah nothing but beans.
Speaker 1:Shout out jack callahan. Um, this is a. This is a new question. Uh, we're excited to start asking people this question because I think it's great. You find this is very similar to the last question, I'll mind you. You find a DVD box set and a working DVD player powered by solar. Um, what? What is the one show or movie, uh, that you would watch for the rest of your life in the zombie apocalypse?
Speaker 3:Oh my gosh, Okay. So TV show I would watch the Dragon Prince. It is so good, it is so cute and it's got all my favorite things elves, dragons, magic and stuff. So that'd be my TV show. My movie oh my gosh, that's tough. Maybe anything from Stephen King king.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, you pick anything. There's not like one that you're like.
Speaker 3:This is the one I would pick shawshank redemption yeah, that one's good yeah, I watched that movie so many times as a kid wow I do misery or pet cemetery? Probably pet cemetery yeah, it's scary, but misery is like disturbing that's the nice thing is it's one's more disturbing, one's more like in your face, scary yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And mythological, which makes me feel better. Yeah, a little bit. I think you passed the test, even though you'll never know your actual score.
Speaker 3:Yeah, those are great answers, okay, sweet.
Speaker 1:You'll find out if you graduate.
Speaker 2:Awesome. So you have been storytelling and writing since you were a kid yourself. What sparked your love for stories?
Speaker 3:Okay, so I've always loved drawing. I would draw in school, I would doodle in class Hopefully my teachers don't hear this I would doodle in class and I always liked putting stories with the drawings I made. And actually I wanted to be a veterinarian for a long time, you know, take care of animals and dogs, because I've had dogs, I've had cats. And then I found out after reading Because of Winn-Dixie it's a really cute book and I found out. I love the story so much that it was just I could. People can make money and make a living off of telling stories and sharing with people and connecting with people through books and I was like, why don't I do that?
Speaker 1:yeah, um, I think, yeah, I mean, being able to follow your, your passions, is like that.
Speaker 2:I feel like that is the dream um what's it like to follow your dream and like, just it's really fun it's, it's surreal, like sometimes I feel like, is this real?
Speaker 3:but at the same time I there are times that it's hard, it's like work, but at the same time I love it. At the end of the day, I love it and that's. I think what matters with dreams is there are going to be ups and downs, are going to be hard it, at the end of the day, I love it and that's. I think what matters with dreams is there are going to be ups and downs, are going to be hard parts, but at the end of the day, if you really love it, then that's what matters.
Speaker 2:That's a good message for all of us out there. I think I read that you were a library kid and you love the local library.
Speaker 3:I love libraries. My school had a really nice library and I would hang out there with my friends. It was so fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I felt like the library was the one place that I wouldn't get randomly harassed by a teacher walking by being like are you supposed to be here? If I was in the library, I think they just kind of assumed that I should be there, or at least didn't want to question it, because at least I was looking at a book, didn't you hide in the?
Speaker 2:library at lunchtime, at some point um, or is that me?
Speaker 1:I've been known to hide a few places yeah, we were both awkward teenagers.
Speaker 2:It's cool you had friends. I was hiding in the corner of the library.
Speaker 3:I mean, I had a very small group of friends.
Speaker 2:I was certainly not a popular kid so um well, I, I'm sorry, dan, I keep interrupting you.
Speaker 1:No, that's okay, you go ahead okay, then it's your turn.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I just wanted to make the segue um that in your series you have an actual location that is a library skeletonia library and is that an ode to your your childhood library experiences, or why was that important for you?
Speaker 3:it is, in a way, I think it's more that I love libraries and I I love, and of course I got to draw it, so I wanted to draw a library too that's pretty rad.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, uh, what inspired you to write the wizards of the apocalypse? Um and uh, what? How would you describe the, the premise of premise of your series as well?
Speaker 3:I would think I grew up loving, you know, fantasy, Like I really enjoyed Harry Potter. I really like all the fantasy stuff. You know, like I just mentioned Dragon Prince, all the elves and stuff like that. But I also love horror. You know I'm a big fan of horror. I love horror movies, especially zombies. Zombies are my favorite horror movie, my favorite horror movie subject, and I was like how come nobody combines these? Because I never really saw one or the other having. I've never really seen a fantasy movie having zombies and I've never seen a zombie movie having fantasy where there's magic and wizards, and I was kind of like why don't people combine these? I think there's magic and wizards and I was kind of like why don't? Why? Why don't people combine these?
Speaker 2:I think there's a lot of potential. I agree, I'd never seen anything like it when I came across your stuff too, and the fact that you drew your stories was like wild to me and really awesome. I mean it's because it's not a comic book. To be clear for folks listening, this is a novel series with illustrations.
Speaker 3:It's got like drawings on the page for each chapter.
Speaker 1:But I do want to do a graphic novel someday, someday um, yeah, one thing that I think about both the zombie apocalypse genre and fantasy is that they're both like this blank template for anyone to tell whatever story they want. Um, like, if you say zombie apocalypse, it puts a picture in somebody's mind and then you just tell the story that you want. And also, if you say fantasy, they're like, okay, wizards and dragons, exactly, and combining the two makes sense because they're both like a blank page for your story.
Speaker 3:Exactly. And again it was kind of just one question popped in my head why not combine the two? And, honestly, if zombies got magic, we'd all be screwed.
Speaker 2:Are we all screwed in this book series? Is that a spoiler? Um?
Speaker 3:not. Uh, hopefully not. Um, I'm still working on stuff. I have a lot of crazy stuff that goes on in book four.
Speaker 2:So it's going to get rough, as the world does sometimes. I think it's really interesting that you chose to combine those elements. Were there any challenges to doing that when you first started thinking about the concept?
Speaker 3:Not necessarily challenges. It was more like the world building, Like how did the zombies happen? And you'll find that out actually in book four. I can't say right now.
Speaker 2:but it deviates pretty heavily from like how zombies shows or zombie apocalypses really start, and it's just different, it's.
Speaker 3:I don't think it's something people will necessarily be expecting and I'm hoping it's like not a good shock, like oh wow, that's's interesting, or I've never thought of that. Oh, that's really.
Speaker 2:That's a teaser catherine, because I love like learning the origin stories and I think it's really smart that you're doing it in the fourth book, right, and people are really hooked into the, the characters, yeah I mean introducing it too early can kind of like I don't know bury the lead.
Speaker 1:Maybe it's like and I I do appreciate when things like that are kept for a secret kept a secret for a really long time yeah because it keeps you guessing when you talk about your book.
Speaker 2:I know you go to like a lot of events when you talk about it. How do you like for folks who have not heard of wizards of the apocalypse before? How do you tell them what it's about? What's your like couple of sentences pitch I.
Speaker 3:I usually say are you interested in like a post-apocalyptic fantasy, which is two words you usually never hear together, and then I kind of explained that it's like if Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings had zombies instead of what they're usually about, like instead of fighting Voldemort, what if they fought a zombie army or a king or you know something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean a lot of times like Lord of the Rings, it's kind of like an apocalypse story. It's just that they're like trying to stop the apocalypse from happening. So this is like the apocalypse happened.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly. So it's a lot of like. That's what I use for my pitch mostly um it's the combined elements.
Speaker 1:Uh, what are your main um zombie inspirations?
Speaker 3:so, as for movies, I love resident evil. I I love walking dead z nation. I also really, really enjoyed what is another one Like Dawn of the Dead. You know, the classic.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Night of the Living Dead and, of course, books. I love reading zombie books, like. I just finished a book called Eden and it's about this. It's where the world has all kind of gone in. People are living in little communities that are named after parts in the Bible, like the Garden of Eden, and there was another one called Jericho and I thought that was interesting.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I'm going to have to, I'm going to have to check that one out.
Speaker 2:It's like literally, I'm like instantly writing it down Eden new zombie book.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I actually have it right here. I know you won't see it in the podcast, but here it is. It's this one.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Yeah, I can see it. Yep, you know, what's funny is that I think I think I've seen this book around.
Speaker 2:It's just it never, never, um, clicked in my brain I think, yeah, were there any specific zombies that you're like? I want my zombies to be like that, or how did you design your zombies?
Speaker 3:so I kind of designed them to where I I didn't want to just copy and paste like what zombies usually look like, which is fine, I have nothing wrong. I love the classic zombie look, but I also wanted them to be more fantasy. So that's why they have the pointed ears, almost like an elf, like a type of elf in a way, but not. And then the green skin I kind of got from Minecraft actually.
Speaker 1:Love that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I love minecraft, you know. Back to gaming. It was, I do play minecraft, but it's I don't play like I don't. I haven't played it in a long time because I've been so busy, but that's actually where I got the inspiration for the. The skin tones and then the ears were from fantasy elves, and then the clothing, or their, like their appearance. I just put them in like medieval clothing and it's all torn, it's still tattered, has blood on it, dirty, filthy, but it's also. Each one has their own character and some of my zombies can wear armor, which I also, again, have not seen very often. So I was like, why not have them wear armor?
Speaker 2:yeah, I don't think. I mean I think there's a couple episodes in low walking dead where they just happen to have on like a riot gear or something like that, but not for it to be a common thing.
Speaker 1:That's really cool, yeah going back to minecraft real quick. I just I just wanted to say that I started. I started playing minecraft in like 2011, and this was before anybody really knew what minecraft was. I was like, oh, it's like a little block game, this will be fun. Um, and then the sun went down and suddenly I'm like, oh, what's, what's this thing walking around? And I'm like, oh, this is filled with zombies. Nobody told me there was any zombies and that game back then scared me so much Because I wasn't expecting it. It's the zombie apocalypse survival game that nobody really credits as being a zombie apocalypse survival game Exactly, exactly.
Speaker 2:Maybe we need to do a special episode about Minecraft zombies. I think so, yeah.
Speaker 3:You should, you should. The new Minecraft movie just came out and I'm really. I want to see it. I want to see it so bad. I've been loving Minecraft since I was 13 years old.
Speaker 2:That sounds super fun. I've never played Minecraft, but I haven't played most things. I'm like I want to be in and hip with all this stuff, but I grew up in the middle of nowhere with no television in the 90s, so the stuff. But I grew up in the middle of nowhere with no television in the 90s, so I'm behind the times with catching up. And your zombies too. Yeah, your zombies are not, uh, mindless zombies either. Can you tell us a little bit about that?
Speaker 3:so I wanted to. I was, it kind of went off the same question what if, you know, the two elements were combined of fantasy and horror? And then I was like zombies never really talk. It was like what if they could communicate? What if the virus didn't like fully shut down their brain? What if they could still talk? They could still plan things, they still functioned.
Speaker 2:I mean, that would be terrifying yes, a zombie that can read, a zombie that can read, read magic.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's what I mean. It's just building off of that concept of the what if? What if zombies could do this, what if they could do that? And when I wanted them to talk, it was just this is going to be crazy. I mean, if a zombie could actually not only bite people, they plan it, they can wear armor and they can actually hunt.
Speaker 2:Now I'm realizing also nobody can see me doing this I'm voracious, voraciously, no, ferociously what's a good adjective? Right now, I'm vigorously shaking my head. No, I don't. I think these zombies are very scary, but then you also this character, zombia, um, which really intrigues me.
Speaker 3:Tell us about them so she is a demi zombie. And what a demi zombie is. It's like it's a half zombie, so it's almost like a demi god. They so their eyes. I don't know if you notice this in my art, but demi zombies don't have red eyes. So the like, real zombies, the regular ones, have red eyes, and then the demi zombies, because they retain part of their humanity. Their eyes can be any color and they don't hunger for flesh, but they still have the look of a zombie.
Speaker 3:They're still, you know, green and they're still rotting, but they have humanity, so they don't want to eat people and they're actually can be generous and they also don't rot as fast, so they, like, they, live longer, if that makes sense yeah that does what made you choose to have a character that was sort of like in between both worlds I think I was always inspired by greek mythology where they'd have a demigod, where they're part god, and I was like what if there was a zombie that was like part zombie and like half human?
Speaker 1:yeah, well, it's a really good idea too, because, you know, I've, I've, I've thought about things like this, but I don't know if I've seen a whole lot of it, and I think that there's a lot of stories to tell with somebody who's halfway between between being an undead monster and, you know, not quite being human either Exactly Well, being human either?
Speaker 2:Exactly. Well, I want to hear more about the characters. So Tristan is the first character we're introduced to Tell us about him.
Speaker 3:So he is the king of Skeletonia. He's a teenager, so that's obviously a lot of pressure, but he is secretly a wizard. So his parents are wizards and he knows he's a wizard, but he knows he can't. He's never been able to be open about it because the cadre, who are basically witch hunters, are killing all the wizards. So, but what sucks is he's a king, he's got to lead people and he's obviously like the front of everybody and he's always seeing people. But he has to hide the fact that he's a wizard. And then when the zombies break into the library and they reveal that there's this whole prophecy surrounding them, he's like oh boy, so I have to not only be a king, I have to hide all of this, still be king and go save the world, kind of thing. That sounds not very fun.
Speaker 3:And he's shy. He's an introvert like myself, so I based him kind of off myself in a way. Like he's very introverted, he gets he's very shy, which is ironic. Like he's very introverted, he gets he's very shy, which is ironic, because he's a king.
Speaker 2:but I feel like that could happen, though is it like uh, is he a king because he inherited the kingdom, like it's a?
Speaker 3:yeah, inherited. So it's like when king tut became king when he was really young, he was like nine when he became king or pharaoh, so kind of yeah, he didn't have a choice, so I mean, it's not his nature.
Speaker 2:But there he is now, a secret wizard king. Oh yeah, fighting a zombie. Apocalypse of smart zombies. I don't want to be tristan at all. Was he the first character that you came up with?
Speaker 3:well, he was actually one of the very first he he's on. Via and tibia were some of my first characters and it was. I have really old drawings of them on one of my old laptops.
Speaker 2:Sorry, there's a train going on in the background that's okay, we can't hear it, but I'm sure it's distracting for you yeah, but anyway they.
Speaker 3:I have really old drawings on my computer of just when I started developing these characters and their old outfits, their old designs, and I would love to show them someday. I just have to find them.
Speaker 2:That'd be really amazing to find them. Hopefully you'll be able to. Does your computer still work? Have you opened it up recently? The old one?
Speaker 3:I have. I just got to make sure the files the files are still there and I can still find them.
Speaker 1:Since you, you you're illustrating your own books and also writing them at the same time. Which comes first? Do you draw it first or do you write it first?
Speaker 3:I write it first, but sometimes when I create characters, I draw them first. So I do a character design where I plan out their outfit, their hair, their look, and then I write them. But when I write the story itself, it's usually I write that first and then I draw what I wrote.
Speaker 2:so it's it's like, in between, are you picturing them as you're writing them? So is there already an image in your mind? And then it's like you're you're translating that onto paper too. Yep, that's really cool. What's it like to actually be able to? You know what this is? Maybe a silly question, but I'm trying to. Not a lot of people can be an author and an illustrator at the same time, and yeah, I'm just wondering what it's like to be so multi-talented, sheesh, basically thanks I.
Speaker 3:I mean I've seen other author illustrators out there, like the. I heard that the author of the how to train your dragon series. She drew all her own drawings, which are super cute, and I've always loved seeing people that could put their own drawings in their books. And it's definitely a balance, because after I write the book I still have to edit it. But then I have to do all the drawings and I actually burned out last year and that was when I got sick, so I had to take like a whole week off of drawing and writing because I got sick. So that's fun, but it definitely is hard sometimes because I have to do all the work and that like the drawing. I mean I have a formatter that does my layouts and everything, but like the actual drawings themselves, that's all me.
Speaker 2:Does it ever feel lonely when you're trying to figure out something, or do you have people you can talk to about it?
Speaker 3:I have people, I can talk to about it.
Speaker 1:I have people I can talk to about it like fellow writers or like my friends in real life and stuff like that. So, um, are there times when you should be writing but instead, uh, you're, you're drawing, because you just kind of go down a rabbit hole. I'm asking for a friend.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes, I do. I do that a lot. I will go down a rabbit hole drawing, looking at art on Pinterest.
Speaker 1:Yep, that's really adding a lot of potential distractions to the writing process that I could not afford.
Speaker 2:I was going to say that, but you do do this now, actually because Dan does 3D animation art. Oh, that's amazing. Since he's been off in the winter, the goal was for you to write every morning and sometimes I'd be working on the couch beside him. I work from home. I'm very lucky, and I will often start my day on the couch before I move into my office and I'll look over and I'm like that's not a work document, Dan, that is your 3D animation app. And I'm like is that what you said you'd be doing right now? But I feel like, ultimately, as long as you're following what is calling to you right now, how do you pull back from that and say, okay, no, now I have to write?
Speaker 3:I exit out of my document and go to my writing document. Good for you, that's some self-control.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I have to to pry yourself away from the hyper focus. I uh, I. I salute you um it's not easy, but I I have to force myself so if you had to choose one character from your book series to be your sidekick in a zombie apocalypse, who are you going to pick?
Speaker 3:Oh boy, I would pick Tibia because she's the tough one and she's got a crossbow like Daryl. Is she a little Daryl inspired? But there's a catch.
Speaker 2:Oh.
Speaker 3:Yes, but she heard there's a catch Her crossbow reloads by itself.
Speaker 1:Oh well, that's good. Sometimes Daryl's crossbow also reloads by itself, Even though it's not supposed to.
Speaker 2:These are things that I can't. I never knew Like I just enjoyed the Walking Dead blithely, catherine until I got together with Dan and we rewatched it together and he's like that's not how a crossbow works.
Speaker 1:I'm like don't ruin it for me. I don't know any different.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I ruin everything. So we've talked about Tibia, we talked about Zambia and a little bit Tristan. I feel like we have to talk about Malice for folks to get a sense of the full scope of this story.
Speaker 3:Okay, so she is a demon and a shadow blood which is just like a really super powerful demon. And that is a demon and a shadow blood which is just like a really super powerful demon and what I. That actually will tie in to how the zombie apocalypse started. But I'm not going to give it away, I just want it to be a surprise but she is indeed the one you're torturing us.
Speaker 3:I'm not telling us the don't tell us, but I want to know, that's all I'm saying you have to wait till 26, and she's the one giving them magic Don't tell us, but I want to know. That's all I'm saying. You have to wait until 26. 2026. And she's the one giving them magic and training them and making them stronger, giving them armor and leading them.
Speaker 1:So yeah, not good. Yeah, the leader of the zombies, if you will. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:What's her motive? Why is she so upset about what she's so mad about?
Speaker 3:It's revenge. She wants revenge on the wizards, because you'll see more about this in book four, but she's on a quest for revenge, basically she's. Then she's very vindictive because she felt she was wrong. It's almost like Maleficent, where she felt she was wronged and she it makes her evil.
Speaker 2:Is there anything redeemable about Malice Like? Do you find yourself feeling sympathy for her sometimes when you're writing her character?
Speaker 3:in a way and this is another thing you'll find out, they'll actually find this out in the prequel I'm working on. I'm working on a prequel and you'll find out that her intentions before were actually pure. She really just. The reason she got into dark magic was because she was trying to help somebody. But it took over her soul, so it was kind of a price she paid and it went wrong. So I guess that's redeemable in a way where it's like her origins were sad, but then, like after that, her as a current villain there is no redeeming quality yeah I find those ones really fascinating.
Speaker 2:Where you like learn about the, the backstory, and it makes you have some sense of that they were I mean, I don't want to, can't really say humanity in this case some sense of their. They weren't always bad. But then you have to grapple with the fact that, well, now they are and like that means we have to do things, you have to make choices that we wouldn't make, uh, if we were not fighting an evil entity with a zombie army behind them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, what's your, what's your favorite part about building, doing the like? The world building of skeletonia is there like a specific part, that like just where it all stemmed from, and you just can't, can't, can't, let go of it.
Speaker 3:I really like the world building. I like is the different how it's inspired by medieval fantasy. So there are medieval times, but I also read a lot of medieval fantasy where there's castles. I really enjoyed building the castle and the army that he has, and then, of course, with the dragon tribes, all the different elf tribes, that was a lot of fun. But I think with Skeletonia it was mostly how I based it off of medieval, like literally a medieval period and it's, you know, he lives in this big castle, he has the guards and he has a medieval village, you know, like a town, almost like medieval england, almost in a way yeah, yeah, I really appreciated when I was looking at your website that you have the map, too, of skeletonia and you can actually go through and like folks.
Speaker 2:If you haven't read yet and you want to get a little bit more sense of the storyline, you can go and click on the different locations and get to meet the characters that way and see them drawn. It's a really nice introduction to your series, but you've got to tell us what dragons whose side are they on?
Speaker 3:yes, the dragons, they are on the good side. Yay, evil, they're not evil, they're not evil um question, uh, can the dragons be zombified?
Speaker 2:no, not yet there's a lot of ominous foreshadowing happening in this episode. I'm here for it heck yeah what about the elf tribe? Or?
Speaker 3:tribes, so the different elves, so the different elf tribes there's. I have four. I have the fire elves, which are also called the dragon bloods, I have the ice elves and then I have moon elves and then I have underworld elves. So there's four tribes and they're all against the zombies, of course. But the thing is is elves can't be zombified. Because of their magic systems and their magical antibodies, they can't be infected. So a little scientific thing there for you. Their antibodies are way stronger than ours and they can't get the virus, but they do use the dragons to keep the zombies off of their territory. But you'll find out in book three.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you've read it yet, but I've not the zombies do try to make their way onto the island not okay, but of course they're going to right. They've got to get that revenge. Um, I'm also really fascinated by the choice of uh tristan, having this, the skill, this ability as a wizard and having to hide it. Was that a metaphor for you in any way?
Speaker 3:In a way, I think it's. You know, I was bullied a lot as a kid, so I was always had to hide my true feelings and hide who I was. So I think that's what I see in him is I wanted to have a character that felt like they always had eyes on them, and he does as a ruler. But it's yeah, in a way, yeah, it's a metaphor of like, just at the end of my book series you'll find out that hiding yourself and just it doesn't do any good. Be yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Because, at the end of the day, the people that will love you will love you.
Speaker 2:And you will love you and the people that don't don't, and that's. That's the truth, unfortunately. Did this book help you or this is not? This book, did this series get, help you come to that revelation, or was there like a moment in your life where you're like this is I'm not going to hide anymore, I'm going to just be myself, unapologetically?
Speaker 3:I think the series helped a lot because I got I like writing makes me feel so free. I can just do whatever I want or have the characters do whatever I want and just be themselves, which is something I did not get to do in my high school years because of all the bullying. But yeah, it was like an escape really, or a release yeah, and you started writing your first book in high school.
Speaker 1:So like like were you even aware that this thing that you were writing into your book was this truth that you needed to learn about yourself as well?
Speaker 3:I didn't. It was originally supposed to be just a fun fantasy story, but then, as I wrote it, I got older and I graduated. I finally started making it more metaphorical.
Speaker 2:I'm really sorry you went through that, catherine, just to be just to say that and I know a lot of people listening may have had their own experiences or may have been on the other side, of being a bully, and I think it's a really important reminder about how, as humans, we need to do a better job of just accepting people for who they are.
Speaker 3:We really do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I'm glad that you have a series that people can read, that they can see themselves in that way. I just wish you didn't have to come out of something where you are harmed in the way that you were. But I think it's kind of magical actually that you were able to try to use a less big word than transmute, shift it, change it, make it into the story.
Speaker 3:Yeah, definitely I. I heard a quote I think it's from Ash Costello, who's one of my favorite singers. She's from a band New Year's Day and she said something about turning your pain into power, and that's what I chose to do is bad things happen to people. It's very unfortunate, but it's up. But we can and I'm not excusing bulliesies, I'm not saying they're off the hook but at the same time, we can take back our own power and use it to rebuild ourselves.
Speaker 2:I guess yeah, I can feel that in my guts. That's like really that's a very powerful statement, catherine yeah, like just turn your pain into power.
Speaker 1:You know this might be a little off topic, but thinking about like being bullied in high school and just you know the endless torment that would come. One of the things that I hated most and it came from like every teacher that I had, every adult in my life was these are the best times of your life. I hated hearing that and becoming an adult I realized they were absolutely wrong. They couldn't be more wrong. My, my life got so much better after getting out of high school because I was among adults who, who didn't just relentlessly try to destroy each other with words.
Speaker 3:Exactly, I hated my teenage years. I hated them. I had, like I say, I had a small group of friends, but other than that, I absolutely hated being a teenager. It sucked.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:What advice would you give to teenagers now that are in that sucking part?
Speaker 3:I would say it won't last forever. There is light at the end of the tunnel. You will make it out and again to find if you can find a support group like friends, family, just if you can have a solid support group.
Speaker 2:I mean, that's how I got out. Yeah, it sounds like you have your own tribe. That you're hanging out with in the library. How did you find them?
Speaker 3:Just in class and stuff we would hang out and my friends love to read and we do homework together and things and we have lunch and all that and are you still in touch with them now?
Speaker 2:I am. That's really cool um for me. I'm just also on a slight sidebar here. I also hated high school and, um, I had a few friends that I really that really helped me through some very dark times personally, but it wasn't until university that I found people that like I could really relate with. All of elementary school and high school was like trying to fit into a specific box, and those boxes do not. I don't fit in them. It's very uncomfortable.
Speaker 3:So I totally get that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think a lot of us have that experience in that age range, just because if you don't easily fit the world and the kids around you and some of the adults who are telling these kids that you can only be a certain way can be so cruel that I think it's really cool that you're writing these books for like 8 to 13 years old. I was curious about that decision to write a young, young kid to young adult fiction teen fiction.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I definitely wanted kids to have a story. They can not only just enjoy, but they could also learn something from it and not feel alone.
Speaker 2:What do you have to take into consideration when you're writing for for eight to 13 year olds?
Speaker 3:Other than not go overboard with the gore.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Where's the?
Speaker 3:what's the cutoff? Cutoff? Well, there's no swearing, like Dan said, and I'm very careful with the gore. I mean, gore does not bother me. I watch horror movies, but sometimes I have my editors or my fellow writer friends. They'll tell me like okay, this might be a little gory, you might want to tone this down. So I do.
Speaker 1:Is there like a specific quantifiable amount of gore, like that you could like measure in gallons?
Speaker 3:Maybe that's inappropriate for an eight year old.
Speaker 3:Maybe like I guess I've had I mean I've written bloody noses I've had people get pretty big cuts, but obviously I don't go with like skin trails spilling out for people being cut in half don't go with like skin trails spilling out or people being cut in half, or I mean I've had decapitations, but not like where you see the blood spurting out of the neck, you know. So I guess that's the best way of explaining it. It's not like people can get cuts. People can get bloody noses, people can get bitten, of course, but it's not like you're gonna see someone like a whole thing of entrails or you know.
Speaker 2:I've never been a fan of gore personally, Like I've come to just sort of accept it and sometimes appreciate it Cause there is an art to it in zombie media. But it strikes me that you actually could also have an adult audience. And I'm just because there are people out there who like, love the idea of it, but also can't handle gore. My mom is one of them. Like she cannot the the jungle book upset her too much. Just to give you context.
Speaker 3:Oh man.
Speaker 2:So I feel like this would be like borderline for her, but I can imagine a lot of adults love your books too.
Speaker 3:What's like what kinds of?
Speaker 2:people come up to you.
Speaker 3:I've had both adults, teens, kids. You know, and I think I know, I market my books as like middle grade or young adult, but that's mainly because you know there is no swearing, there's no sexual activity and there's no, the blood is very toned down but, honestly, anyone can read them. I've had older people read them, I've had young people read them. It's so I like I say when I, when I say they're just for like young adult or middle grade, that's just like the content more the content, but anyone can read them.
Speaker 2:That's really awesome. I think that age ranges are just a guide, cause I really find that.
Speaker 3:I like a lot of young adult fiction. Me too, I do, I love it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, what's it like to have someone come up to you and say I read your book and I loved it.
Speaker 3:It makes me again. I feel surreal. It feels like for a minute I have to process it, like did they really just say that? Like that's so cool, and then I thank them and all that, but it still feels surreal, like it's cool.
Speaker 1:I mean, I love it and I'm really appreciative cool.
Speaker 3:I mean I love it and I'm really appreciative and I'm really really grateful when people do cause. It means a lot and I really love my readers and I want them to always feel safe and be happy and that's really sweet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, as as your, as your series progresses, your, your characters, I imagine at least are getting older. Do you think that if, if it continues on long enough, that the uh, the focus age group will also increase?
Speaker 3:um, in a way sort of, but it's still gonna be that like no swearing, no um, low gore, no spice kind of thing. But they like maturity, wise and understanding.
Speaker 2:They will grow I think you can have a great story without any of those things, definitely.
Speaker 3:I'm not against you know those kinds of things. It's just it's not stuff I prefer to write.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, and also, like like you mentioned, leah, there's definitely a group of people that you know they would love to experience these stories, but sometimes it can just be too much, whether it's like the, the content of it is just too dark or it's it's upsetting because there's so much gore and violence that, like this, this could, this could be easily be like an approachable point where, like I think, I think this is a niche that needs to be filled, because a lot of times when you think of the zombie apocalypse, if you're getting into it, you might think the expectation is to go over the top and just describe some of the most brutal and disgusting things that you can imagine. But there's a group of people that definitely want to have these stories but don't want to be assaulted by it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I am not as far gone as my mom, but I am one of those people Like I don't like gratuitous gore and I like that your stories are focused on the characters and the world, and zombies are a part of that world, but it's not just like we're gonna. You know, although it would be kind of fun to draw that something really gross. I've been lately gotten into katherine. I had no idea. I also am an artist. Um, oh, that's amazing. And I never drew gore before until we started the design book club, and now I really love doing it, but it makes me laugh while I'm doing it because it feels so ridiculous Making this really gross eye right now.
Speaker 3:That's so cool. You're an artist. That's amazing.
Speaker 2:Thanks, I mean, I'm not, it's like the thing I do because I love it and I think again, that's why I admire you for having that self-knowledge in high school and then just going for it. If I could go back in time and tell I don't know 15 year old Leah that it would be possible to do something as cool as what you're doing as a young adult, I think that, um, that version of me might've gone for it. So, it's really inspiring.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely. All the the adults in my life were not encouraging me to follow my dreams and aspirations, it never would have occurred to me that I could be a writer because I'm like, no, I'm bad at school, I get bad grades, I can't write. And for you to be able to see that at such a young age, I'm very envious, because I could only imagine the things I would have done if nobody was telling me no, you have to find a practical job and just go there for the rest of your life until you die.
Speaker 2:I realize we're making an assumption, though we don't like. Did you feel supported as a young, as a teenager, to follow your dreams?
Speaker 3:I did. I definitely my. My family supported me. It was more um, my fellow classmates didn't support me and I even had someone like tell me that it wouldn't be worth pursuing writing because I wouldn't do well at it or I wouldn't make any money and it wasn't worth that's a common thread right now, especially among indie writers, is like the.
Speaker 1:the expectation is, you know, you might, you might make like five dollars a month, um, but there's also a lot of people that they, they, they actually do succeed, and I don't think those stories are told nearly enough, especially to younger people. Not at all, cause really you really have to follow your dreams, because if if you're not following your dreams, I don't feel like it's it's worth it to just go through the motions of life. You know like I, I go to a job because it finances my dreams.
Speaker 3:same exactly, and you're doing great with that. Yeah, thank you so nice.
Speaker 2:Um, I'm curious what the challenges were along the way of. Like you know you. Thankfully, you had support from adult figures in your life, but you were also surrounded by some not so great people who were being jerks, if I may say, probably a nice word for how they were treating you.
Speaker 3:How did you keep pushing through that and continuing to decide to write this story and explore it and draw, even with that in the backdrop, yeah, I like I say I would come home and I would just draw kind of escape my own into my own little world and work on my stories. But as I got older I also I do a lot of meditation, I do journaling, where I just like I've used to write about my feelings in a way like not kind of like a diary, but now I just journal. And I also do a lot of shadow work where I like reflect on myself and kind of just who do I want to be? And other people are like kind of telling myself that other people can have opinions and they can have opinions about you. But that doesn't mean they're true. That doesn't mean you have to fall into that box. They want to put you in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel that I went to like three different high schools and the second one was the worst.
Speaker 1:The first one I was starting to make a little bit of headway, then left went to a really terrible one. Then the third one. I think I had that same realization where I was like I need to focus on who I want to be like the people here will see me however I choose to present myself, so I'm going to work on thinking about who it is I want them to see when they look at me. Um, I don't know if I did a good job, but it was a revelation.
Speaker 2:yeah, I'm sure you did great I think that that's like one way to do things, but sometimes, um, that's not an option. Yeah, you know, like, um, because of your identity, like where you're from, what your race is, what your gender is, um, your sexuality, like these things can be. You can't just like figure out. You can say, well, this is what I want to be, but the thing you want to be is not going to be palatable.
Speaker 2:Yeah to the average person and I think that it's really extraordinary to keep focusing on the thing that you loved amidst that kind of pushback, and I feel like a lot of adults, including myself, are still working on that. Yeah, like the wisdom that you just shared, I think it's really important to remember for us, too, that it's okay. People don't like you also, it's just their perception of you and yeah, it doesn't mean, it's true.
Speaker 1:Yeah I imagine that this probably uh shifted a little bit over the years since you started. But where are you? Are you a plotter or are you a pantser?
Speaker 3:I am both, so I mostly I can plot like the big storyline, but pantsing comes when I'm actually just writing the story. The dialogue's all pants. It's all like off the top of my head what I can come up with at the time. I mean, of course I go back and edit and change if I need, but I plot the story but everything else is just comes out of my brain.
Speaker 1:Chaotic neutral. I yeah same, you know, I think. I think most of us try to plot um and then the, then the uh.
Speaker 2:The universe of our book laughs at us and tells us otherwise have you ever really surprised yourself and been like, oh okay, we're going here now. I did not plan that? Yep, so we've talked a little bit about the? Um then, the latest book you're working on right now is the shadow bloods revenge, right? Yes, and I think the last update I saw was that you had 40,000 words written already. Where are you at now?
Speaker 3:I'm at 51,000 words and in hoping it's probably going to be close to a hundred thousand, I'm not sure yet.
Speaker 2:Insert applause here to have 51,000. Thousand, I'm not sure yet.
Speaker 3:Insert applause here to have 51 000 applause. Oh my gosh, it's gonna be. It's gonna be a lot, because there's a lot that goes on in this book a lot of world building, a lot of character development. So it's a lot that's going to be going on and it's um again asking for a friend.
Speaker 1:Um, when, when, when you write a hundred thousand words, how many words do you think you delete?
Speaker 3:hmm, a good portion of them, definitely. Maybe half, sometimes Not probably not half, but a good portion like a quarter of them. Yeah, just like filler words or sentences that could be clipped or scenes that maybe go on too long.
Speaker 1:Does that make you feel better? Dan, A little. I feel like I've written my book six times and just kept. That's okay. It is because it's much better now. But no, I mean my friend did that, because I'm asking for my friend. Dan, cut out the part where I said it was me All right.
Speaker 2:No, it's important to be vulnerable. We're modeling vulnerability right now, Dan.
Speaker 3:Exactly.
Speaker 1:Do you ever get stuck when you're writing like hit roadblocks? Writer's block.
Speaker 3:Yep, I do. That's when I draw.
Speaker 1:That's a good thing to be able to shift to, because I imagine that really frees up a lot of ideas while you're doing that.
Speaker 3:It does.
Speaker 2:Yeah, does the writer's block contribute to burnout in any way, like when you're trying to, or or are they like connected in any way?
Speaker 3:because I do wonder about that having to sit down and like work on something every day sometimes, yeah, I can definitely contribute to the writer's block and sometimes, if I really really need a break from both, I go read or I go outside or I go hang out with friends or something to like really, really step back is there ever a time where you're like you know what I think I'm done, I really need to do something different yes, sometimes I, I sometimes just I need to step back and I just that's when I go read, or I there was one time I took like a week off of drawing and writing because I was so burned out you say a week, like it's a long time, and I'm like I went years without drawing.
Speaker 2:I think it's amazing Like it is a long time. It sounds like for you. You sound like you're somebody who's drawing every day, a lot of the day.
Speaker 3:I do yeah.
Speaker 2:So a week is a good time for you to take, but I think that there's I've experienced, just like seasons of things Sometimes I'm making a lot of art, sometimes I'm making none. So again, like to take a week sounds very healthy as like a little break for yourself, and you definitely deserve that with how prolific you are in such a short amount of time.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the longest I've gone without drawing was probably a month, and that was because I was in Europe, so that's a good excuse.
Speaker 2:You were busy doing other fun things. Did Europe help inspire any of the castles?
Speaker 3:oh, totally so. Like I say, I don't know if you've read book three, but there is the out. The one of the elf tribes the moon elf tribe is based off of ancient rome and I was in rome for a few days on this trip and I loved looking at I mean, they're castles, but they're like the Coliseum and the Forum and the amphitheaters and stuff.
Speaker 2:There's nothing better for inspiration than actually going to places like that. I remember going to Wales oh I don't know. It was like 2010. It's a long time ago Nice and seeing castles for the first time and I was like blown. I mean, I'd seen a castle because I grew up in Canada, just as an aside and in Toronto there's this place called Casa Loma, but it's more like a tourist place. It was a rich person who built a castle like structure, but it's only like 100 years old or something like that. And to go to Wales and see ancient ruins was really striking and also humbling to realize how long people have been around and all the wild things they've done. Is there something about the medieval period that you find really compelling?
Speaker 3:um, probably the castles and the knights and everything.
Speaker 2:I really like that would you choose to live in the medieval times?
Speaker 3:no, so no zombie apocalypse?
Speaker 1:horribly yeah well, it's true, you don't want the plague, no yeah, but I mean no, no, I'm no.
Speaker 3:They treated women horribly.
Speaker 1:No, thank you that era is really fascinating, though, and it's like, it's definitely like a a very specific period of time where, like, large stone castles were, like the, the forefront of, like of of military defense, and all it took was a few innovations to make them completely, um, inadequate for what they, for what they did, so, like it died out fast. Um. So, like, if you see, if, if you're looking at a castle, you definitely think of that period and you're thinking of all the how, how different that time is compared to where we live now yeah, but then when you're in a fantasy world like you've created.
Speaker 2:It's like fantasy is set in that time but at the same time the rules are completely different. Like how are women treated in skeletonia?
Speaker 3:oh, they're treated like eagles, totally I there are women knights there are, you know, totally like yeah, they're treated equally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's a. I think sometimes people get stuck in this thing of like. If I'm writing about, even if it's fantasy, but it's in the medieval time that it has to be like, quote unquote, true to the time and what do you? Think about that.
Speaker 3:It doesn't have to. I don't think so. I mean, women were treated horribly and I obviously didn't want to write about that.
Speaker 2:So yeah you say obviously, but like it sounds like there was something under there that was really important to you.
Speaker 3:I don't like the way women have been treated. I'm really I grew up in a Catholic church where women were not treated well and it was the typical like oh, oh, you have no bodily autonomy, you're not, you're just there to be a wife and have babies and raise children. And I'm like, I'm against that, I don't like that. I mean, I'm fine, totally okay if you want to be a mom and have children, but it should not. Again, it's a box.
Speaker 2:Don't shove people into that box yeah, and that sounds like maybe why you have a tibia character, for example.
Speaker 3:I do I'm, I'm very yeah, I'm very voiced about a lot of things, but mostly when it comes to like feminism and everything, I'm very, very I can be, I can get pretty voiced about it um for a good reason.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's a lot of legitimate reason for that. I think we might have talked with this a little bit, but just checking with you, I know that the book you're working on right now I read on your Instagram that it is a book that will resonate with anyone who has felt like giving up and I'm curious why is that an important theme to you? Is it calling back to the bullying? Are there other things that you're trying to share?
Speaker 3:It's both. It's a lot. I mean, there are times I felt like giving up and there are times I've felt like there was no way out. But I want. But there is there always is a way out. You know you can always there's help available. There's always going to be people that want to help you and that's what that's about is. It's going to be a time for those characters to be like they feel like they want to give up, but you, you have the strength. You don't have to. You can always like find help and there's always again, there's always gonna be help available and you don't have to do stuff alone yeah, is there someone in particular that um helped you, that you think about when you think about this?
Speaker 3:like my, the story itself or like someone in real life. Someone in real life, I would say my best friend. She's helped me a lot, you know, she really supported me and, of course, my dad's really helped me out a lot, you know, just being supportive and showing me that again, there's always help available and I don't have to be alone. So that's that's great, yeah, and for anyone's that again, there's always help available and I don't have to be alone.
Speaker 2:So that's, that's great, yeah, and for anyone's listening out there, if, if you are feeling alone right now, um, maybe reach out. You might be surprised by who could be willing to help you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, I think you bring up a good point that there's there's always people that want to help. I think it's also true that they don't necessarily know that you need their help unless you ask for it.
Speaker 3:You have to. I mean, it's not easy to say I get that it's definitely hard to admit you want help, but it's available.
Speaker 2:Why do you think it's hard for people to admit it?
Speaker 3:Because it's vulnerability, You're putting yourself out there and admitting hey, I can't do this alone I think our society also treats it like a moral failing that you are.
Speaker 1:You can't be the rugged individual that they, they say you should be like, admitting that you need exactly help from somewhere else yeah, and we're human.
Speaker 3:We can't.
Speaker 2:We're not meant to be alone thank you, this is one of the things that I could also be very voiced about, as you say. This is one of the things that I could also be very voiced about, as you say, is that I think our society is so individualistic and humanity as a species was never meant to live like that. We need each other. Is that a theme of your book too?
Speaker 3:It is Togetherness, camaraderie, friendship. It is very important because, especially in a zombie apocalypse and there's few people left, you want to have that, you want to have a good proof yeah, um, do you have any advice for young writers and artists who, uh, dream of creating, creating their own stories?
Speaker 3:definitely. Just don't give up. You'll find just right, like, even if your story is not perfect, even if you have to rewrite it, that is okay. I've had to rewrite my story a lot, so don't feel alone and you will find your people and just yeah, just keep writing, don't give up, because there is always going to be someone out there who will read your story. Yeah, and we can always use more books in the world, or more movies or more TV shows. You know, yeah, use more books in the world, or more movies or more tv shows. You know yeah, so just do it. There will be an audience. And if you can't even find a good support group, yeah, and everybody starts somewhere, so like exactly.
Speaker 3:You don't have to be famous to start. Just start, that's what matters.
Speaker 1:It's better to start than to not yeah, and like, especially for young people, I feel like, um, you know, a lot of times, though, a lot of people will say, well, I, I don't know, I don't know how to do, do that, I'm not very good at that um, and especially, if you're young like you've got. You've got a lot of time and if you, if you start right, then you might become great you can learn.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's every. I learned every, everything that I taught, but I did for my book, you know, I taught myself, I researched it, I asked fellow authors.
Speaker 2:Was it scary to publish a book the first time?
Speaker 3:In a way, yes, it was scary. I was mostly nervous Like, oh my gosh, I hope people like it and I get that. If it's not for everybody, that is fine. With every book there are a lot of popular books I don't like, but I think what helps is knowing that there are going to be people that like it. You will always find someone out there that will enjoy it. So yes, it was scary, but as time went on I started to realize that it was just you know what people that like it will like it, and if they have people that don't, they don't.
Speaker 2:that's fine yeah, you're our second uh person that we've talked to recently. That I'm like okay, motivational speaker. We've been joking about having, like a zombie creators retreat. Like okay, booking katherine for motivation that'd be so fun.
Speaker 3:That would be so fun. Oh my gosh, if you guys actually do that, let me know, okay, it might happen.
Speaker 2:It might happen because I think it would be very, I was thinking like just adult summer camp for zombie lovers.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that'd be so fun.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, we should yeah uh, how does meditation help you with writing and drawing?
Speaker 3:just the clear headspace calming. Sometimes I meditate on specific things I need, like self-love or gratitude or just being calm, just being quiet for like five to ten minutes I feel so old saying this.
Speaker 2:I don't know how old you are and you don't need to tell me, but I know that I've I've been alive longer and I feel like how amazing would it be to have started meditating earlier in my life, like I do it now, and it's helped me a lot, and I think I just hear a lot of wisdom from you and the way that you see the world and the way that you think about your work. That I have a feeling is something to do with meditation and the fact that you've chosen to be so intentional with your life.
Speaker 3:No, it's definitely taken practice, though, and you know it's never too late to start. I wish I had done meditation and journaling when I was in high school. I think that would have helped a lot, and I'm very I am now. I consider myself very spiritual like not religious, but spiritual, like you know, the whole crystals and all that and it's very calming to me and it's very helpful because it helps me step back and be at peace when, if something's chaotic.
Speaker 2:I was wondering when I read the the grimoire right like that was something that I learned about when I started exploring um paganism and witchcraft and things like that, and I thought it was really cool that you incorporated that into your story. I did?
Speaker 3:I did because I've my dad is irish, so I've read a lot about Celtic backgrounds and paganism and stuff and I don't consider myself a pagan but I am definitely spiritual. I grew up Catholic but I'm obviously really not anymore and I'm not religious at all. I don't consider myself religious at all because it's definitely caused a lot of trauma.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think we would be friends if you were closer, because it sounds very similar. Like I, I have a lot of um interest in like celtic paganism and I think that there's some value. In the wheel of the year, for example, like I saw you celebrating I don't remember what it was, it must have been a soul, it was something recent, so maybe the star.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I, I do celebrate the Sabbaths. I don't do like a big party, but I do like a self-celebration where I do the cleansing and whatever is necessary for the day, and I love that stuff. I think it's what fits me best. Yeah, and that's why I wrote it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think it's great to include that, because it's another option for being connected to spirituality that isn't organized religion no, I will never write organized religion unless it's for a purpose and it's usually going to be a bad purpose like a like they'd be evil, like it'd be, like you can consider the cadre an organized religion interesting because they're witch hunters. They're witch hunters, they're witch hunters and I never specifically say who they are, but they are. You can consider them witch hunters. So the super organized religion. And so, yeah, if I ever do write organized religion, it's usually they're the bad guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's understandable. I have a friend I'm not going to say their name right now, but they left a religious cult as a very young, like a, I guess, like young adult, like 18, and started exploring other spiritualities. And they have that. They still have that experience sometimes where they feel like, oh no, I was told that to have anything other than believing in this one thing was evil, and it's really hard for them sometimes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's the problem and like I'm not here to obviously I'm not here to shame anybody or bash anybody's beliefs, but I definitely agree there is a problem with organized religion and I can see why people are leaving it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that resonates with me as well. Fun fact in the army, you have to put your religion on your dog tags.
Speaker 3:Oh man.
Speaker 1:And I was looking at these blank spaces that you put the letters for, the letters that make up your religion, and I didn't have. I'm like can I leave it blank? But then I'm like I could put anything in there, so I just put Jedi Knight.
Speaker 3:Nice, I love that. I didn't know this. That's great yeah.
Speaker 1:So there was a period of time where people just referred to me as Jedi. I mean that's pretty great, Just because it's on my dog tags.
Speaker 3:I love that.
Speaker 1:What's the most fun, or possibly just the most rewarding part of writing this series.
Speaker 3:The most rewarding part is knowing that my story is out there and that I'm I'm fulfilling a dream that I had since I was a kid, so I think that's really rewarding. And, of course, again getting to connect with people like you guys, and that's just super rewarding as the community.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean that's. I mean that's the purpose of this podcast is like trying to find that community that was, honestly, I feel like very hard to find before. Yeah, and and I. I love it because I love talking to people about zombies, and people at work are getting tired of it.
Speaker 2:My coworkers are too. I'm known as the zombie person at my work, which I don't know, but again it's like it's a good example of.
Speaker 2:for a while I was like I'm not going to tell anybody at work that I do this. And then I was like this is such a big part of my life and it's a big part of what I love and like. If that makes them, I'm not going to like force them to watch a zombie movie with me, but I am gonna just share that I love zombies and that was like my whole personality like.
Speaker 3:I have friends that don't like zombies, but that's okay yeah, we can like different things.
Speaker 2:That makes it interesting. I don't know if this happens to you, but I'm. My only fear is that when I was a kid, I was obsessed with unicorns frankly, still am, and that's cute. For so long, I just only got unicorn things and I have a feeling that for the rest, the next little while, I'm going to get only zombie things. That's me. Yeah, you only get zombie things.
Speaker 3:That's me uh, well, dragons. Like you see behind me, I have dragon things, I have zombie things, I have mostly halloween things. I guess is it is the collective term- yeah, the best holiday.
Speaker 2:So you already best holiday ever. I agree, we still have um his name's rod zombie. He's a life-sized zombie at our front door. We got him for Halloween and we just decided you know what? He stays up all year. Leave him up. Yeah, Leave him up. His shoes are starting to kind of like fall apart, so I need to do something.
Speaker 1:So we might need to do something. Well, like I said, maybe it's even more appropriate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're right. Yeah, you should be disintegrating slowly.
Speaker 1:When the wind blows, just right. Sometimes he peeks his head in through the front door and scares, scares our dogs.
Speaker 2:This is real and us we'll come upstairs Cause we our bedrooms on the like a walkout basement and so we'll walk upstairs and we have to pass the front door and they'll literally just be a zombie face like staring at us kind of crooked through the doorway. It's made me jump a few times.
Speaker 3:That is so fun. Yeah, that is so fun yeah.
Speaker 2:I was going to ask you, though. Like you know, you've already fulfilled a lot of dreams, and so I'm kind of curious what your dreams are coming like going forward.
Speaker 3:Let's see Well, to publish the rest of my book series, the rest of my book series, and I would also like to get into animation. I've been slowly practicing how to animate and eventually I'd love to do like a mini series of my books, but it's like a, a youtube series kind of thing. So it's not quite like netflix where it's episode, it is episodes, but they're not like 30 minutes. Yeah, they would be maybe three, four, five, six minutes, like they'd be really short. They'd be animations, it'd be little pieces of my story. That sounds so fun. I'd love to do that someday.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's the kind of thing I can be like mom. Let's watch this together, because we have a hard time finding things we would both enjoy.
Speaker 1:And then she'll be like it's just like the Jungle Book, ah. And then she runs away. Exactly so. You know you have some. You've recorded audio books for your books. What made you decide to make that investment?
Speaker 3:I think, again, it's to reach out to more people, because again, there are people that you know have dyslexia or they can't read very well with their eyes, or you know they have jobs like truck driving. I want to make it more accessible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I absolutely appreciate it, because I really don't have time to read with my eyes so a lot of my reading is done in the truck and also it helps the day go by like I know um, I, I love, I love the length of a book too, because it's you know, I, I can get a book and that's going to last me like the week of driving and I can just fully immerse into the story yeah, you could.
Speaker 2:You could listen to all. Like how many hours are your first three books in total as audiobooks?
Speaker 3:Oh gosh, I don't know. I have to do the math. I will have to look, but I think the first three probably over 10 hours, I'm sure. Yeah, Easily over 10 hours. Like I say, I'll have to actually look and add them up, but that's a nice road trip.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's a great thing to put on, like if there's parents listening. A great thing to put on when you're driving that your kids can enjoy and you can enjoy would be super fun. Exactly nice to be immersed in a world. Well, yeah, uh, it has been a lot of fun to get to know you. I'm so glad we finally got to do this. I've been, thank you, following you like a fangirl on instagram for a while now.
Speaker 3:You're so sweet and I've I've been loving your guys' stuff too. It's been great. We'll have to like, definitely hang out again soon.
Speaker 2:Do a zombie retreat, maybe a virtual one, yeah, or something else fun. That's step one. Yeah, I'm in Yay. In the meantime, where can people find you and your books and your audio books?
Speaker 3:They can find them on and Barnes Noble, and eventually I will be doing signed copies through my website, so that'll be fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'll have all those links in the description.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and your website's really great, so we'll have that as well for folks to check out, and you can also. If you want to hang out on Instagram, you're also there. What's your handle on Instagram?
Speaker 3:Authorxzombie. That's where you'll see all my art. I'm on hiatus right now. I've just been taking a break from posting. I mean I'm still active, I'll still answer DMS and messages and stuff and I'll put a post, a story, once in a while, but I've been mostly taking a break. But I'm there. Um, if you want to reach out or anything, definitely I will get it.
Speaker 2:That is awesome. Uh, that is awesome. Well, I think, unfortunately, it's the end of our time together. Oh no, I know we have to leave the world of the Wizards of the Apocalypse and come back to this one. Ah yeah.
Speaker 1:There's no magic in this world. There is.
Speaker 2:Well, I know too bad. Is there no magic in this world? Who here doesn't believe in magic? You know like side eye all of you.
Speaker 1:I think the billionaires are hoarding the magic no, they can't.
Speaker 2:Can they hoard magic?
Speaker 3:I feel like this is a good debate you know, I don't know, I mean is, uh, it's jeff bezos just hoarding magic?
Speaker 2:I think he is yeah, maybe he has a, an evil wizard helping them out.
Speaker 1:Maybe you know this is something we'll look into I could see it.
Speaker 2:We did learn recently that um voodoo practitioners helped bill clinton get the presidency. This is a true oh my gosh, a true slash, not true story that we heard, yeah, um, on another interview. Yeah, so you never know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yes, that was also us oh boy, yeah, I'm like, I mean I wasn't. I was very young when bill clinton was president. But I mean I don't know, you know I was too young. But I'm not gonna take that off the table though yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, the fact is is that they went on honeymoon to haiti, and so then there's like all this story around it. So who knows if it's true or not, but I'm gonna go on record and say I believe in magic. Uh, I do, too. Really amazing things happen that are not explainable, and if you don't believe in magic, that's cool too. That's the whole point of this uh world we live in is we can all have different perspectives. But in the meantime, please go check out katherine larkin's work. It's super fun, it's great for adults and young folks, and you can just enjoy the art, like the art alone will be really, really beautiful to look at and explore the map on our website and come hang out with us all on Instagram.
Speaker 3:Heck, yeah, this will be fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, thanks everybody for joining us on the zombie book club. If you want to give us some support, you can leave a rating, a review, send us a voicemail up to three minutes. No longer than three minutes, it won't let you. I tried At 614-699-0006.
Speaker 2:I don't know how many zeros, that was, but figure it out, also in the show notes.
Speaker 1:It's in the show notes. You can see it with your eyes. You can also follow us on Instagram at ZombieBookClubPodcast, where we are hanging out with our Instagram friends like AuthorXZombie. Also, you can join the Brain Munchers Collective Discord. All the links. They're in the description. We're in all those places Also. We have a newsletter. That's in the description. They're in the description. We're in all those places Also. We have a newsletter. That's in the description too. You can sign up for it and then we can communicate with you if the billionaires take away our internet.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or make the algorithm change in some way we can't predict. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, thanks for listening everybody. The end is very, very nigh.
Speaker 2:Bye-bye, everybody Bye-bye, bye-bye.
